Termites (or wood ants??) devouring my dream home...

[KelsieG]

Thanks, everyone, for your advice, and for solidifying that YES--I need to proceed with caution and find out as much as I possibly can about the integrity of the home's structure before I fall even more in love...

The good news is, my boyfriend's father is a home builder/carpenter, and he's coming out with me tomorrow to take a really, realllllly close look at things--going up into the attic, crawling underneath, and, hopefully, finding a way to take a look at what's under the siding. He can not only help evaluate the damage done by the termites (or ants), but he can also take a look at the plumbing, wiring, etc. The other good news is that if the damage is not TERRIBLE but rather just perhaps mildly awful , he can help us repair it, which would save CONSIDERABLE money that would have been spent hiring a contractor.

Fingers crossed, everyone. I've looked at a LOT of other houses in the past few weeks that have made this farmhouse look like a freaking showplace!

[eclecticcottage]

We had carpenter ants in the Old House. They only go where there is damp/previously water damaged wood. They aren't eating the wood, they tunnel in it to nest and to eat other bugs that are in the wood. Our damage was bad but fixable, the biggest trama was pulling down some old drywall and having several thousand ants fall out and run every which way in our bedroom. *cringe* (we later had a HUGE yellow jacket nest in the same place, they got in through a very small crack and we ended up with thousands of bees in the bedroom) Our issues came from a poorly flashed chimney which allowed water to infiltrate the framing and backer to the siding.

[sooth]

I'm kind of with Patchules here. RUN. This could be minimal, or the entire house couldbe infested and cost untold thousands to fix. What if most of the beams in the house are eaten. The photos of the beams that you showed look very crumbly and unsafe (to me). I would really try to find another house (I'm sure there are others).

If you really want this one, no matter what. Then brace yourself for the worst case scenario. Are you ready to tear down walls, replace all the structural beams, replace millwork, trim, and other (custom$$) wooden items. I would assume that the house would need to be completely fumigated. What if the ants/beetles return a few years down the road? Etc...

[kat]

Where in the country is the house located. Here in the south on the coast, theres two kinds of houses those with termites and those going to get termintes...

But do a good structural survey with your relative, as the critters are expensive. they ate a chunck out of my dining room floor and that was pain enought to fix.

[KelsieG]

Well--my boyfriend's father (the contractor) crawled under the house and up into the attic. He of course saw the damage that I had photographed, but he said the house seems really sound, still, and he didn't see any active infestation or major structural damage. He got almost teary-eyed when he described the attic to me--huge, solid oak support beams and soaring rafters...he was apparently in awe, and there was no damage up there, he says...not even water damage from the leaky roof. The roof, however, does have about four layers of shingles on it, including the original wood ones...but I already knew it had to have a new roof.

It also definitely needs a new heating and air system. The duct work is in place already, thank god, but the units are 20+ year old dinosaurs that lack efficiency, even on the off chance that they work.

So...I'm not giving up yet. Just trying to gather my resources and play my cards right. The realtor was with us as we looked at all these things, and he said he's 99% sure the bank would not only accept a low offer, but a RIDICULOUSLY low offer, were we to want the place.

And that's the thing...I DO want this place. I know it needs a lot of work, but the sale of my home would more than cover the major stuff if we were to get this place for cheap. I've been looking at tons of houses and NONE of them have the land, charm, historic appeal, or seclusion this farmhouse offers. What's great is that it's only 10 miles from town, but because it's totally surrounded in cornfields, you feel like you're completely and totally alone. In that respect, it's absolutely perfect.

Considering getting a septic and well inspection...the well, from what I've heard, is superb. Not sure about the septic, though. :/

[sooth]

Well this sounds a bit less grim than I was expecting, so it sounds like you're going to go for it. If that's the case, maybe find out if the under side/lower sections of the house could be treated with something like Bora Care (which is a penetrating wood insecticide that would prevent any future infestations/bug damage by making the wood poisonous to them). Otherwise it sounds like things are otherwise pretty decent. I can't wait to see photos.

[KelsieG]

If this goes as planned, there will be MANY photos...my oh my there's so much work to be done. 80s light fixtures. Nasty PINK carpet (with painted hardwood underneath). Bare bones bathroom. Ummm...kitchen? Let's just say it's a blank slate with some pretty gross mismatched cabinetry. Fireplaces...there are two, and the mantlepieces are awesome. Not sure about the fireboxes or hearths, seeing as they've been DRYWALLED OVER and CARPETED OVER.

BUT...

Transoms and hardware remain above all interior AND exterior doors. 2/2 double-hung windows are in very decent shape (save some broken glass and one termite-devoured bottom sash). Original millwork on porch and gable is, somehow, in PERFECT shape. Original woodwork and doors are all intact and only covered with one layer of paint. The house has very, very great potential, and it's not the cosmetic stuff that scares me at all. I've always wanted a project house, and this definitely is one. All the good stuff is still there. The bad stuff just needs to be taken out and/or replaced. Good thing I've been collecting turn-of-the-century light fixtures all these years!

I'm trying not to get too excited, because I don't want to jinx anything...but it feels good to talk to SOMEONE about it. Will keep everyone posted.

[steponmebbbboom]

kelsie... firstly please remember I do not know you and could be completely wrong, so do not take any of this personally as I mean no offense.

you sound young. (like me). and this is not your first house so you have obviously done this before. when I read your posts about this house the first things that hit me are the emotions. when you have deep pockets this is not a bad thing. for the house of your dreams, it is a very good thing! but the second thing that hits me are the comments about ways you can save money and make the numbers work in your favour. so it seems you may not have the deep pockets that are required to address the many nasty and very expensive surprises an old-house can throw at you. and this is an old-house in the country, where real estate sales tend to be slow and a house can be on the market for months, even years, without interest.
believe me, i'm with you. i was looking at houses for over a year and a half, and once i got approved i had the good fortune of having a realtor as a friend who had the patience to take me through DOZENS of houses over several months before i found this one. i busted his chops from beginning to end. the primary reason this took so long is because I had to have a pre-war home with a high level of original finish, solid brick, and restoration potential. with some other personal considerations. but he had the motivation to make sure I bought right. Now I don't know the specifics of this house other than what you posted in this thread, but I can see the emotions seem to be running wild with no one there to rein it in. This can spell disaster for someone like you or me with a limited budget and resources.
from what i've learned, two things: future value and future marketability. can you restore this house without losing your shirt on the money invested. And in an emergency, can you sell this house in a reasonable amount of time if you experience a financial crisis. old houses are beautiful whether they are restored or not, if you look at it a certain way. but restoring it in order to add actual value to the property takes not only an investment, but a high degree of skill, sophistication and resources. do you have the time and money to restore the staircase, windows, plaster etc. properly, can you take care of all the structural issues (which generate little to no return on investment generally) and still have money left to put the Wow factor back into the house (remember the house is covered in vinyl siding) and remember, the house is still outside of a major urban center. I would never consider taking out a mortgage on a house outside of a fast-moving market. You must be financially established before buying a house that will not easily sell.
that is not to say there aren't any sad looking houses in the country that could be brought back to magnificence by a motivated and responsible owner.
but let me explain: we are looking down the barrel of another economic meltdown. one cannot afford to overlook the future value of a home unless one is already well-established and not about to take on a huge mortgage expense they will be responsible for decades down the road. it costs very little to live once a mortgage is paid off. but if you are five years into a mortgage and lose your job or get divorced, can you afford to put your house on the market and have it sit there for months, and in some cases years, without so much as a walk-through?
likely not.
you will probably have to firesale it to get it sold and take a huge haircut on your investment. you could be left with a mortgage you still owe money on and no home to show for it.
a young person with little equity cannot afford to buy a home these days without carefully considering future value. you have to look at every improvement your house needs in terms of cost/return if you want to keep your head above water.

I have been restoring antique cars for most of my life. the biggest adjustment I had to make when I started looking at houses was in regard to money. I can buy a rustbucket for a couple hundred bucks. I can put a few grand into it without affecting my credit or quality of life; in fact my latest project I didn't even need to borrow money on. But a house is the biggest investment you will ever make. I bought right. (with a lot of help) I am in a neighborhood that is poised to go up in value due to an upcoming infrastructure development, and the house is structurally sound with no major issues: i can do projects at my pace, in my time, without detracting from its value (if i make the right choices).
your house is out in the country and has a major termite problem. god help you if you go bust halfway through renovations and have to put it on the market with repairs incomplete. remember: some of the rags-to-riches restorations you've seen unfold on this site and in magazines were generously financed by independently wealthy and very lucky enthusiasts. for those of us not there yet, there's a lot more to consider than the future aesthetic potential of an old-house. People talk about their houses being saved from the bulldozer but Who Is Going To Save You?
take your time, and buy right. even if the house needs nothing, you still have a mortgage and several years to pay it off. making a mistake, could bulldoze YOU.
this very long post is the result of over a year and a half of shopping for a house and countless hours and hours of conversation with a realtor with over 36 years of experience in an economically depressed housing market. i sincerely hope whomever you are working with on this house is doing the right thing and playing devils-advocate when you express your love for this house, because that is exactly the kind of dialogue you need to be having when you walk into a house and "like" it. Houses are elephants. It's not like a car. If you throw the dice on this house trying to save it, it can crush you like a bug. So be careful................

[KelsieG]

Hey Steponme....

The circumstances are actually a little unique in my case. Yes, I am young (29), but....my "mortgage holders" are my parents. The house I own at the moment has no mortgage. It's totally paid for. My parents bought it five years ago, and I've been paying them back every month, ever since.

They have agreed to do the same for this house--pay cash, and I pay them back. The equity I've gotten out of my current home goes towards the new place, and its necessary repairs.

So...no actual mortgage is involved. I owe my parents money (no interest).

The economy's continuing death spiral is one of the primary reasons I want to do this. While having a market garden, chickens, and goats has always been a dream, making that dream a reality seems now, more than ever, to be imperative. I'm not a starry-eyed city girl who has no clue what farming entails, either. I've worked on farms my whole life, and I'm ready for a small one of my own (or as ready as I'll ever be).

Other reasons I want to do this--and feel almost certain I will succeed at it--is because even though 29 is young...it's teetering on the edge of the years we enter into as we get into comfortable ruts. I'm ready for a change. A big one. And right now, I have a TON of time to do projects and get my mini-farm established. I teach 5 week, once-weekly English writing classes in the adult education program for a private college. Some weeks, I'm gone out of town for one or two nights, but also many, many weeks go by where all I'm doing is teaching online or, better yet, waiting for the next class to start. I'm salaried, so I get paid the same regardless of whether I'm working or not. A dear friend of mine just committed suicide, and I'm not going to lie...it's made me think twice about letting myself just laze around while I could be doing the things I've always wanted to do.

This incredible flexibility in my job, the generosity of my parents, and the dire need to be as self-sufficient/self-sustaining as possible are all factors that help me see I'm faced with a potential "now or never" situation. I DO have some part of myself grounded in reality, though. My parents are very savvy when it comes to real estate, and I know they won't let me get into a total money pit--they're too wise for that. They also know, though, that I have some fantastic people on my side. My boyfriend's father is, as I mentioned, a contractor, and has offered to help us do much of the work that is needed. Another good friend is a very experienced woodworker and carpenter. Another is restoring a house of his own and has offered tools and expertise. The bank has agreed to an allowance to cover most of the roofing costs.

I hope this doesn't sound defensive! I'm just wanting to explain that my circumstances are a bit beyond the normal scenario. I probably still sound like a big ol' fool, but again, I'm not going to do anything unrepentantly foolish. I just have a feeling this will all fall into place..I have a feeling I'm thinking the way I'm supposed to be, right now.

[steponmebbbboom]

nice.

i'm with you all the way on the motivations. believe me i would do the same thing if i had enough equity to do it. i don't think you're a fool. but i do think you want this to happen really really badly, so much so that it may be impossible to be objective about the true cost of repairing this house.

this is not the last house that will come your way that will meet your needs. if you need to dump your current house NOW, you would be better off to do that and move in with your parents until you find the right property than to rush too quickly into one with so many unknowns. you could even ask for 90 days closing and avoid moving back home.

this house has been on the market over a year. you have all the time in the world to research it properly. if someone puts in an offer in the meantime, you can always ask to be kept uptodate on it and have the chance to offer your own. if you can't beat the offering price, maybe you can beat the terms. bigger deposit. flexible closing. no conditions on financing or home inspection. there's always ways to compete with an outsider that won't destroy your budget.

i lost my dream house before i got this one. it had everything i wanted, except for major foundation problems. it was the hardest thing to let go of the overpowering desire to buy it and fix it. but once i did, i realised that the repairs needed were way more than i could handle. i still miss it, but i have no regrets over buying this one. believe me, your house is out there. maybe it's this one. but it doesn't have to be.

(http://www.powerofcommunity.org/cm/index.php)

good luck